Author Topic: Southern Hemisphere recommissioning  (Read 1198 times)

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Offline Ginge

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Southern Hemisphere recommissioning
« on: December 26, 2018, 05:15:15 am »
Right.

Back in New Zealand with two running Triumphs but the BSA C10L with C11 engine is still to be commissioned

A couple of questions....

I've just put a solid copper head gasket into the C.  The old composite one blew out.  I haven't started the bike yet.

I'm also chasing a charging problem so I'm running on total loss electrically.

I want to start the bike to bed the new head gasket in and check the Dynamo voltage output but I think I need to get the bike good and hot to get the gasket seated first, when it's all cooled down again.

How far can I go with a total system ( no lights )?  30 mins? 60 mins?

Will this get everything hot enough to bed the new gasket in...

After that I can work on the charging issue which will involve starting and stopping in short bursts to check voltages and current.
Ginge.

Online MilitaryRon

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Re: Southern Hemisphere recommissioning
« Reply #1 on: December 26, 2018, 06:02:45 am »
Ginge your coil should draw around 4 amps per hour, so if you have, say a 5 amp battery, you will have arguably 1 1/4 hours or running. Which is well over what you need to run the bike for a head tightening sequence. It's just a case of getting the bike up to temperature and then re-torque the head bolts.(Which only requires being done once with a solid gasket)  2 or 3 miles is ample.  You could then recharge the battery for another 10-15 mile run if you want a bit of a shakedown.

When I ride a coil ignition bike (most of mine are magneto) I always carry a spare 5 amp dry cell battery and 2 x 3-4 foot cables with the appropriate connectors on the ends, so that a slave battery can be connected in an emergency from my shoulder or pannier bag..........I have been caught out as other forum members can contest, when the regulator on my Indian special shorted out the other side of Winchester (50 miles from home) and I lost all charging. My 10 amp battery carried me home without a blip.   Ron

Offline timsdad

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Re: Southern Hemisphere recommissioning
« Reply #2 on: December 26, 2018, 08:36:38 am »
I normally run the bike up, or other vehicle, in the shed to working temperature, maybe about five minutes or so on an air cooled engine, and then stop it and check for any leaks of fuel, oil or exhaust.

I can then fix any leaks, fire it up again if necessary to recheck, and then let it cool overnight before pulling down head bolts and resetting valves. Then it's a road test and, if it's my bike, re-check the bolts and clearances the next morning.

Works for me!


Ray
Just a motorcyclist.

Offline Ginge

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Re: Southern Hemisphere recommissioning
« Reply #3 on: December 26, 2018, 05:41:16 pm »
All good then. Thanks lads.

Watch this space for Dynamo and regulator questions...
Ginge.

Offline Ginge

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Re: Southern Hemisphere recommissioning
« Reply #4 on: December 30, 2018, 07:18:51 am »
As promised, Dynamo and regulator questions.

I have an E3L Dynamo on the C11 engine.  I had it rebuilt as part of the restoration years ago and it has charged in the past.  Produced voltage and motored on the bench twelve months ago but didn't charge on the bike.

I have been using a new MCR2 Reg that I bought new and fitted in 2008.  Everything charged and worked back then.  Bike has been in storage off and on though.  I think it is still usable, just not regulating.

I bought a DVR2 hoping I could go to 12 volt to match my other bikes, but the DVR2 instructions require a field resistance of 2.5 ohms.  Lucas service sheets say my E3L should be 2.8 ohms.  I only have 1.3 ohms.

This is a C11 engine in a C10L frame.  To access the dynamo I have to remove the primary side cover, footrests and brake lever.  All possible but a pain.

What happens if I run the DVR2 with a low field resistance ( on 6 volt)? Will I harm the Dynamo or just get low charge?

I have the MCR2 on the bench.  Are there simple tests I can do to work out why a low mileage basically new regulator doesn't perform?

All thoughts gratefully received.
Ginge.

Online MilitaryRon

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Re: Southern Hemisphere recommissioning
« Reply #5 on: December 30, 2018, 07:45:13 am »
You say you bought a new MCR2, so I guess it's one of the Indian repros. They are crap and renown for giving up the ghost after a very short while. It's strange that they've been able to sell so many over the years.  Ron

Offline moth

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Re: Southern Hemisphere recommissioning
« Reply #6 on: December 30, 2018, 08:46:12 am »
Don't mix words Ron. Get to the point.
 :D India just beat us at the cricket so  they have some quality parts! Where did I put that sand paper...........?
Moth
1948 C11
2009 Thruxton

Offline Ginge

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Re: Southern Hemisphere recommissioning
« Reply #7 on: December 30, 2018, 09:06:23 am »
The bike's been on the road off and on since about 2006.  I bought the MCR2 at the end of the restoration around 2006 so I don't think it is a rough reproduction.  Indian reproduction stuff has only gained momentum in the last six or so years.  If I am wrong and it is a rough copy there must be some way of telling whether it has functionality left in it.

Moth, it's not sandpaper- it's sports tape.  Perfectly legitimate on a cricket pitch.
Ginge.

Offline timsdad

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Re: Southern Hemisphere recommissioning
« Reply #8 on: December 30, 2018, 09:33:07 am »
You've only got to look inside it to see if it's an Oriental reproduction. If you don't really know what they should look like then you need to borrow a Lucas one to compare.

As Ron said, but I would use stronger terms, they are unusable for charging purposes and folk must just buy them to fill a space on the bike when on display. That's quite a market place!


You won't hurt an old Lucas dynamo, Ginge, they are so robust. The worst you'll do is learn nothing and maybe have to re-polarise the dynamo again to get it to motor, and then charge again when the regulator and/or wiring is sorted.


Ray
Just a motorcyclist.

Offline Ginge

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Re: Southern Hemisphere recommissioning
« Reply #9 on: December 31, 2018, 06:50:43 am »
Okay, more on the recommissioning project....

Pulled the MCR2 off and started the bike to bed the new head gasket in.  Got no voltage out of the dynamo so taped the leads up and went for a ten minute ride up and down the street.  Bike heated up and is cooling over night. 

Will retorque the head down tomorrow and set valve clearances again.

While the bike was cooling I pulled the Dynamo off and put it on the bench.  Now I have field resistance!  On the bad side when I pulled the end cap off the Dynamo I think my wiring is wrong. 

There is no wire to one of the end cap terminals (D) and one brush is detached and I don't know where it attaches to.

Photo for discussion

Ginge.

Online MilitaryRon

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Re: Southern Hemisphere recommissioning
« Reply #10 on: December 31, 2018, 06:58:57 am »
I think you've found your problem Ginge. If you go to Service sheets on this site - Electrical - Dynamo, there is a information with diagrams.  Ron

Offline Ginge

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Re: Southern Hemisphere recommissioning
« Reply #11 on: December 31, 2018, 11:42:33 am »
Have looked at the service sheets.

Am I right in saying that the loose brush wire on the left of the photo should just attach to the unused terminal on the Bakelite plate?   That would be the terminal on the right hand side of the photo.

For clarity, the brush wire on the right is already securely attached to the Dynamo body ( earthed) together with a lead from Field.

The other Field lead is currently attached to the F terminal on the Bakelite plate.

So it's just a lead off - brush wire to D terminal?
Ginge.

Online MilitaryRon

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Re: Southern Hemisphere recommissioning
« Reply #12 on: December 31, 2018, 12:50:46 pm »
It should be exactly as you've just described, I guess the nut was loose and just vibrated undone, i'm surprised it didn't fall out when you took the band off.  You can test the connection are right by motoring it on the bench with a 6V battery. It should motor in the direction that it would normally be driven. You should also polarize it. by earthing the body to a 6V battery (poss or neg depending how your bike is earthed) and with a lead from the other terminal of you battery, spark it on the F terminal for a few seconds.  Ron

PS Lucas polarization spec added.
« Last Edit: December 31, 2018, 01:07:31 pm by MilitaryRon »

Offline Ginge

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Re: Southern Hemisphere recommissioning
« Reply #13 on: December 31, 2018, 01:12:15 pm »
Thanks Ron.  I reckon that's all it is.  Just a missing nut.  Now I'm worried about where the nut is....

Hopefully not hung up in the Dynamo casing somewhere. 

Appreciate your on-going support.

Happy 2019 mate.
Ginge.

Offline stev60

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Re: Southern Hemisphere recommissioning
« Reply #14 on: December 31, 2018, 07:38:03 pm »
Going back to your comment on head gaskets, the composite gaskets are crap, I blew two on a C ll before going to solid copper. Carbon fibre are a great alternative.
Steve